Info on Halo Boat Pedestal Seat Shock/Suspension

All:

Reference this post here where Classic Parker was contacted by Halo Suspension Systems to see if any CP’rs wanted to try out some new ‘pilot’ suspension seat posts to modify your existing boat seat pedestal. Matt (HM5) brought us to their attention and I am pleased he did. While there are competing devices on the market, this one is designed to fit right into your existing seat post, which does need to be cut down to get your “ride height” back to where you may have had it.

While I did not get the chance to run it offshore, I did run through other boat wakes and my own boat wake to try it out. In a word –
A W E S O M E would be an understatement, said as only a boy from Boston can mumble! Even better, was the assistance from Halo. Now - remember – these are the FIRST test units to hit boats of real users. Both Matt and I had some small ‘teething’ issues with the installations, but that is what we were being asked to do … try out the fit, finish, installation (to include the manuals, instructions, and tools (gauge & spanner wrench included) to make sure they’re suitable for use by the layperson.

Now I readily admit my seat post was of different dimensions, even though it wears a Springfield footrest. I had upgraded it after I had sheared off a stock Parker (’92 vintage) seat post (they did NOT make it) whilst chasing tuna in seas one day. Uhhh, yes - I was going too fast for the sea conditions and 2-3 waves joined right ahead of me and looked like Mt Everest in front of the bow! I ended up with the suspension unit stuck (won’t come out), but not yet fully tight. Again, since mine was custom and the 1st custom unit, things might be expected to need tweaking. But get this! Halo offered to send out a Technician TODAY, to my boat, to fix, repair, or remove it, as needed! Man, that sure is customer service!

Using good ol’ Rube Goldberg’s proven DIY methods, I simply duct-taped the top collar in place to prevent it from turning, then took it for a ride. But first I set it to my body weight. The high pressure pump and gauge are serious items and worked slick! When you first sit in the seat, you’ll drop ~1/2” to pre-load the cylinder. From there, I’d hover above the seat and drop myself down into it. The cylinder would move less than an inch and I believe there’s more than 2” of said travel. The response was tremendous ! Acting just like the cushioned shocks on the fancy mountain bikes I’ve driven.

I for one am sold on the concept and even have a few ideas as to how to make it an easier install into the existing seat tube, which would have considerably less machining, and this might lower the retail price even more.

Stay tuned for more … plus pictures!

Glad it's working for ya! Having a seat setup that keeps the boat from crushing your spine makes the boat 100x more enjoyable.

In my opinion, it should be, at a minimum, a factory option for pilot house boats.

Competition is a good thing. We now have two options. The Halo option and the Seaspension option.

Time will tell which one can hold up to the rigors of extended use in typical seas.

In the meantime.....enjoy that smoooooth ride.

I received my Halo seat post yesterday and plan on installing and testing this weekend. I will take some pictures and comment back. They are calling for 2-3' seas on Sunday morning and some rain. I will be out there and let you know how it does. I will be borrowing my friends tubing cutter to lower the post to accommodate the Halo. Right off I like the quality feel and look and think Halo may have a winner here. I also like the capability to adjust the ride to your weight, sea conditions that is a big plus. Once installed you should hardly know it's there up under the seat.

MaxOut":1uyach5c said:

I will be borrowing my friends tubing cutter to lower the post to accommodate the Halo.

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Word of advice, GO SLOW with the tubing cutter, make sure she is sharp, and allow it to CUT. If you force it, you will compress the wall of the top of the cut where cut, in effect making the opening of the ID smaller. Believe me, you do NOT want to do this. Make darn sure the ID at the tube mouth is the same as the tube body or you will have problems with the install.

If I were to do it again, I'd use a tubing cutter to scribe a line square around the tube, then I'd use a thin jeweler's type saw for metals to make the final cut through.

Oh ... you'll LOVE the seat suspension! Forecast up here is for seas of 4' to 7', though I don't think I'll burn the gas to head out 12-miles just to test it. OK, well maybe ...

Thanks for the advice Dale and I know exactly what you are talking about as I have cut allot of tubing and it tends to flare it inward if you go too fast. I just got a call from my friend and his cutter only went to 2 5/8" so he bought a brand new 4" three blade cutter and is bringing it buy to use tonight. I will go slow and being new I’m sure it is sharp my only concern is having enough room to swing it without taking the post out. I have a hand held band saw with a fine tooth blade that would work but hoping the tubing cutter will do it as there will be no burs to deal with. Anyone need a 3 1/4" of seat post tube looks like I will have one soon. :lol:

pictures please. I am interested to see what it looks like and how its installed. from what i have read it goes on top of the existing stock post and because of its height the post needs to be trimmed to proper height? then it has an air bladder that you can set the pressure to to adjust for your weight.

Brad:

What you see at the bottom is the complete assembly that gets inserted into your existing seatpost.



Yes, to get you BACK to where you were (seat height) one does need to trim the existing seat tube height. What I did, as a double-check, was to measure the seat-front-to-the-floor dimension with a measure. Then once I sit on the seat (body weight pre-loads and compresses the suspension shock ~1/2") I'll check to make sure I'm there.

Air bladder? More like a high-pressure air cylinder !

pretty cool. im assuming the large black piece at the bottom is what gets inserted? It has a collar on it that keeps it from sliding too far into the post? the top and middle pieces are just things that get inserted into the black part? How does it dissipate the energy from being compressed? the only thing that i can think of with that system is the stress put on it after some time considering that its not a solid post attached to the seat but it may have a solid steel bar in it for all I know. Makes sense that it would be cheaper than seaspension since its just the shock system and not the full post.

BradV":2fkc3d6g said:

... assuming the large black piece at the bottom is what gets inserted? It has a collar on it that keeps it from sliding too far into the post?

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Yes to all.

How does it dissipate the energy from being compressed?

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Brad, please review by CLICKING THIS POST HERE.

the only thing that i can think of with that system is the stress put on it after some time considering that its not a solid post attached to the seat but it may have a solid steel bar in it for all I know.

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I've asked that question and have been assured the strength of the shot-peened post (strengthens it) is equivalent to replace the seat post. Whereas the shear force 'moment' has been shortened to now be from the seat base to the top of that suspension, versus from the seat base to the floor, for an OEM seat post ... you can visually that the moment has been reduced by a factor or 4-6X or more (depends on your post height).

hey dale do you have anyone near you that has the seaspension so you can jump back and forth on the same day? id be interested to see a comparison. what adjustments or recomendations do you have so far minus the installation issues?

Well I finally got my Halo suspension installed and gave it a test drive. This is how it went.

Installation takes about 10 minutes and is a piece of cake, this is what you need-

• 3” or bigger tubing cutter. The one I used is a 41/2” Rigid and worked great with plenty of room to swing it without taking the post out.
• 2” masking tape
• Strap Wrench (not in pictures but needs to be min 3”)
• Pencil
• Spanner Wrench (included)
• High Pressure Air Pump (Available From Halo Optional, I would get it)


Pictures below do the talking for the installation (in reverse order). In the directions included it states the suspension adds 3.2” of height and you may want to try it without cutting the post to determine how much you want to cut off. I determined I needed to cut 5.5” off to end up with the complete installation ½” higher without any load. Because I like my seat back all the way I did not want to add more than ½” height so the seat would clear the starboard side step below the window from the inside when the seat swings. Once I set the air in the suspension to 200lbs. = 170lb rider the preload was approx 1” and perfect. Because of the interior cabin ceiling you will probably not want to add height to your seat post or in my case you would end up with a sore head.

Test Drive-

Well my first impression was that the suspension seemed a little “loose” I checked the preload and the pressure was not set properly. My fault as I did not relive the pin on the pump before removing and lost pressure. Got pressure to desired weight and next impression was “Let’s Find Some Waves” We had 15-20mph winds with gusts to 30mph and some pretty good 1’-3’ tight rollers. Fist I approached the waves at 30 degrees to get a light impact and the seat absorbed them with little movement very gracefully. Next I spotted a couple of spread out 3’ waves and decided to hit them head on. I had two other passengers and could see the cringe on there faces as I slowed over the crest to let her drop and get a good hit. The seat performed excellent and absorbed the wave with ease. The shock did not bottom out or “pogo” the initial wave and following waves were graciously absorbed with one controlled rebound each. My overall impression is the fit, installation; price and performance are a win win win! I have a few suggestions for Halo to improve installation even better but overall I highly recommend. I have ridden on the Seaspension and feel this seat even performs better and is more practical. The adjustability was key for me as I only weight 165lbs and a suspension designed for 250lbs would be too stiff. I would say for me the Seaspension was like riding in a F450 were the Halo was like riding in a Lincoln. The Halo is very responsive at lower air levels and never felt like it bottomed out even though I did hit bottom while playing with the air pressure. Only time can tell the durability but based on my observation it seems well engineered and looks like it will stand the test of time.

I fixed mine over the weekend ... simple issue that will be corrected in install manual and condition of unit as received (mine was already cranked to full tight as received).

More later ...

GREAT devices !

whos gonna be first to put one of these on their seaspension post?!

BradV":13h945z0 said:

whos gonna be first to put one of these on their seaspension post?!

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Sounds like you

even i dont drive that crazy

Is there a website for these or does anyone have a price? my back is telling me to check into this before the next long season!!

Jamie, I was at the factory just yesterday, (1 1/2 hr drive down I95) and work is progressing. I reviewed some changes that are anticipated to the locking bushing assembly that holds the unit inside the seat tube.

I brought the prototype unit back to have the components inspected after about 3 months use (and abuse, damn, I love my Parker 8) ). A new unit was built to replace it, as, some parts are destroyed to take the shock unit apart. It looked the same as when it was assembled and installed back in July.

While there I got a tour of the manufacturing area. They do a bunch of different stuff for other companies. Final machining operations are their speciality. While in the assembly (clean) room, they were checking the machine tolerances of a difuser ring for some Navy destroyer project, (no further details available or they would have had to kill me :wink: ). In another area there were triple head multi axis CNC machines making parts for different customers. I saw processes machine the heat exchanger castings for Cummins engines like the ones that are in the ferry I work on. And if any of yu'al are golfers, they are making a high tech putter for a customer. Neat stuff. http://www.frankroth.com/

To answer your original questions, not available for retail yet. Website is http://www.halo-pi.com , but Walker (Lou's son in law) said that this is maybe a Christmas break project to get the info up on their site.

Here is another thread with more info on this unit, http://www.classicparker.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=7198&highlight=halo You may contact them to see if you can get in on the trial program I outlined in the above thread. E-mail Dave at: [email protected]

Thank you for your interst and you may also contact me should you desire more info.

Not trying to knock the product but looking at the picture and having had quite a few hours on my seaspension, I can already see one of the weak links.

The neck. The part shown in the picture as having the rubber cover, that inserts into the seat. My guess is that there is a shaft that runs in that rubber cover. That shaft is what is going to get stressed every time the boat pitches. As your body and it's weight recovers and puts pressure on the back of the seat, that shaft is going to feel it. I'm no engineer but I'll bet the early failures will be with the shaft.

Larry, please go back to the link above where I answered Jamie, and scroll down to the description by HaloLou, who was the engineer, within that thread for the engineering of the internals.

Specifically to address your concerns about the side loading of the inner tube, I excerpted that section as follows:

2. A high performance precision telescoping strength member (fig 1 middle) made of aluminum and hard coat anodized. This telescope consists of an outer tube with four longitudinal flats on the ID, and an inner tube with four corresponding longitudinal flats on the OD. Eight hardened steel races are in each of the grooves, to protect the aluminum from Brinnelling. Between the opposing races are bearings that allow the inner tube to move smoothly and longitudinally in relation to the outer tube. It is impossible for the inner tube to rotate in relation to the outer tube. However the seat can rotate as before. The ID of the inner tube is burnished to a single digit finish after hard coating. This high finish surface provides the smooth walled air chamber for the air spring, and which provides the opposing force when compressed. .

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As you look towad the top of this thread where the picture of the internals are, the silver colored piece is the inner tube and is some kind of aircraft aluminum machined billet item, as are the rest of the parts, (don't know the spec number exactly), that has a wall thickness that is heavier than the Springfield seat tube which is soft. The pirmary side load is distributed the full length of the hardned strips (dark part against the silver tube, and again Lou told me what the Roclwell hardeness number was but I forget) and the roller bearing strips between those inner and the outer strips. This is a design that has proven itself in the extreme sports, racing mountain bike community where longitudinal and lateral shock forces often occur simultaniously and in extened duration.
These components are not stamped sheetmetal or zinc diecast pieces

As you indicated yourself, neither am I an engineer, but I am a technician, and from my experience with this unit, and having seen them taken apart and assembled, I am quite confident in its durability both internally and externally.
I am also quite sure that the integrity of the Seaspension folks and the people at FrankRothCo/Halo is similar, in that using proven technology, neither would build something that purposely would injurously break.

TheOtherLine":1g6hoyl5 said:

Not trying to knock the product but looking at the picture and having had quite a few hours on my seaspension, I can already see one of the weak links.

The neck. The part shown in the picture as having the rubber cover, that inserts into the seat. My guess is that there is a shaft that runs in that rubber cover. That shaft is what is going to get stressed every time the boat pitches. As your body and it's weight recovers and puts pressure on the back of the seat, that shaft is going to feel it. I'm no engineer but I'll bet the early failures will be with the shaft.

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Sounds like buyer’s remorse on the Seaspension :wink: Putting down a competitor’s product is typical of a used car salesman approach to sell a product that has no real merit but cost more. Sorry I have a Halo and I like it better than the Seaspension I have ridden on. No doubt the Seaspension is a good product but performance of the Halo (in my opinion and everyone else here who has one) is great and comes with excellent support at nearly 1/3 the price. Obviously the longevity of the product is yet to be proven in this application but is not new technology.