cranking batteries vs. deep cell

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stonebuster

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I went to the marina today to replace my deep cycle batteries that came with my 2004 XL w/225F Yamaha. I was told by the Yamaha tech that deep cycle batteries were not recomended for my engine anymore. He said that was straight from Yamaha and had to do with the amount of amperage that these newer motors put out when charging not being good for the deep cycle batteries. I got 3 years use out of these deep cycles and never had a problem. He said you could get away with the deep cycles but when it comes to replacement, use cranking batteries. He sold me 1000 CCA. Maybe old news but it's the first I've heard that. Anyone else aware of this or have I just had my head under a snowdrift too long?
 
hmmmm....wonder if your marina/dealer is out of deep cycle batteries? :D
 
stonebuster":1pfwssln said:
He said you could get away with the deep cycles but when it comes to replacement, use cranking batteries. He sold me 1000 CCA.

I have (3) batteries on board. (2) deep cycle and (1) 1000 CCA dedicated to starting.
 
Hard to say... I know that the HPDI's had/have a problem if they don't have enough reserve power to power up the computer, ignition, and everything else that stesses the system at startup. As I recall, the requirements for those motors was pretty high. Maybe the F-series motors are having similar issues?

Do you have any deep draw devices on your boat that are in use when the motor isn't running? If not, high capacity cranking batteries might just work well in your situation.
 
Kevin,
No high draw items really. Just FF, radio, and GPS left running at anchor. I try to only use the spreader lights for a short time. Sim from THT got back to me and said Yamaha recommends cranking batteries or deep cycle/cranking dual purpose batteries with the following minimum requirements: MCA-675, CCA 512, reserve 182 at 25amps. AND, whatever battery you chose it should be a battery you can add distilled water to when neccessary and not maintanance free or gel type.
 
I was following along pretty well until this part:

stonebuster":3rbqr2jg said:
AND, whatever battery you chose it should be a battery you can add distilled water to when neccessary and not maintanance free or gel type.

I'm not a fan of using gel type batteries in our applications, but it sounds like Yamaha is suggesting that only flooded cell batteries be used, and I would take exception to that thinking.

This whole subject of batteries has been beaten to death over on THT, and folks can get quite passionate about their selections, and their reasoning. :shock:

But lets face it... the typical fishing vessel in the 18 to 28' range doesn't require a huge bank of "house power".

We need power for navigation lights, chartplotter, sounder, VHF, and maybe some deck lighting. Other major items we might have on our boats that consume extra power might include radar, and livewell pumps...

Of all these items, the only ones drawing semi-serious "house power" when the motor is off would be the livewell pump. Radar wouldn't (normally) be operating, or it would be in standby mode, and the rest of the items aren't things that require huge banks of batteries to operate for a reasonable period of time.

Many of us have even taken steps to minimize our power draw. Upgrading navigation lighting and deck lights to LEDs has considerably reduced our power requirements. Everything else regarding power usage is just being aware of our draw, especially if the motor isn't running, and compensating accordingly.

Having said all that, I've come to the conclusion that for my application and for my vessel, I'd be fine with a set of cranking or dual-purpose batteries. Obviously, each of us has different requirements, so YMMV.

After considering the power needs of my electronics, lighting, and the needs of my OX66, I selected a set of Group 27 Optima blue-tops in my vessel.
I've been running these batteries for the past 3 years without a battery issue, and I don't expect any.

Image-5C4BC7DA4F5411DB.jpg


When the day comes that I need to replace these batteries, I'll probably move up to Group 31's... just because of the way I am about my equipment.
However, because I do like to be prepared for emergencies, I also carry emergency power... :D

Image-5C4C28044F5411DB.jpg


I believe that each owner should access their own needs taking into account the power needs of the motor, as well as the other devices on board.

The next step is to assess how the vessel is used. Are you sitting on the hook all night with the spreader lights on and livewell running while you're fishing?

Have you switched to LED lighting and do you minimize your electrical draw in order to extend the life of your stored power?

Point is, there is no single answer. Everyones needs are different. :wink:
 
Megabyte":polrekiq said:
Hard to say... I know that the HPDI's had/have a problem if they don't have enough reserve power to power up the computer, ignition, and everything else that stesses the system at startup. As I recall, the requirements for those motors was pretty high. Maybe the F-series motors are having similar issues?
The interesting thing there is that those motors require a minimum VOLTAGE to light up the brain, ecu, et al ... and not AMPS. With a pure cranking battery, one could theoretically have a battery that was still capable of puting out a ton of amps ... but at low voltage.

I dunnoh, I've always had best success using premium dual-purpose batteries.
 
I've never had a battery related problem on my most recent boats either. It just caught me by surprise when I was told not to replace with what came with the boat and that's what prompted my question. Sim said he was quoting "verbatum" out of the Yamaha manual, including the part about gel and maintaince free batteries so that's what I passed along. I'm the first to admit, I'm no mechanic, so that's why I put the question out to more knowledgeable folks. Thanks for the replies and information, Mike
 
DaleH":1baaj1m7 said:
The interesting thing there is that those motors require a minimum VOLTAGE to light up the brain, ecu, et al ... and not AMPS. With a pure cranking battery, one could theoretically have a battery that was still capable of puting out a ton of amps ... but at low voltage.

As far as I know most electronic ignition systems need a minimum of 11.5 volt in order to work. otherwise they cant generate a strong enough spark to fire the engine.
I've run across the same problem with a motorcycle with an old weak battery. A mechanic friend filled me in on the details.
Your car,truck and nowadays possibly lawnmower is the same way, needs 11.5 minimum.
 
I converted my battery trays from group 27 to group 31, and installed a pair of group 31 dual-purpose lead-acid (not the maintenance free style) batteries. I'm very happy with the results.

I'll never have maintenance free batteries on a boat again. Though they are maintenance free, they still need water. I burned one up because I stupidly believed the maintenance free claim. Now I have no doubt...I check the water every couple of months.
 
BTW, the other think I did when coverting battery trays was to put those big terminals on the transom, and put all those wire rings on the transom (getting them away from the corrosive effect of the battery). I installed 4 ga jumpers from the terminals to the battery. Solved almost all of my corrosion problems (where the little thin rings corrode to nothing at all). Those big rings on the 4 ga wire will take a long time to thin out.

The conversion of the trays and the installation of the terminals are documented in the projects folder.
 
I guess it's a marketing thing, but flooded cell batteries should never be labeled "maintenance free". :|
 
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